twilight2000-digest Thursday, July 9 1998 Volume 1998 : Number 032 The following topics are covered in this digest: Signal to Noise Ratio Re: Cash on start Oops Re: Cash on start Oops T:2000 alternate settings Re: T:2000 alternate settings Re: T:2000 alternate settings Re: T:2000 alternate settings Re: twilight2000-digest V1998 #30 Re: T:2000 alternate settings Re: Cash on start Re: Cash on start Oops rascism Re: T:2000 alternate settings Re: rascism Re: rascism/alt.setting.com Re: rascism Racism Re: Racism Re: rascism Re: rascism/alt.setting.com Re: T:2000 alternate settings New settings Re: New settings Re: New settings Re: New settings Re: New settings Re: New settings Re: Cash on start Oops Re: Cash on start Oops Re: Cash on start Oops Re: Cash on start Oops Recoil New to the list Re: New to the list Re: New to the list Re: New to the list Re: New to the list Re: New to the list Re: New to the list ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 11:33:16 -0500 From: Mitch Berg Subject: Signal to Noise Ratio In the last few days, the number of posts has grown to an astonishing level. Which'd be cool, 'cuz I obviously like talking T/M2k with like-minded types... However, as the traffic has grown, the quality of the discussion has dropped, shall we say, through the floor. I think we all know who I'm talking about. Look, I got tired of RPG-ing with overdramatic, socially-challenged, motor-mouthed (motor-keyboarded?) "special" adolescents after my first (and last) week of Dungeons 'n Dragons. Could we all - just amongst us - ignore the lil' twerp and hope he'll go away? Not answer posts, not respond, that sort of thing? Just a suggestion. Mitch Berg Humanware Design - www.humanwaredesign.com (612)644-4192 User Interface Design, Usability Analysis and Information Engineering. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 10:20:52 PDT From: "Donald Harden" Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops >In a message dated 98-06-25 09:11:45 EDT, you write: > ><< This sort of thing doesn't work if you plan on staying there (never > piss in your own sandbox). >> Monkey boy writes: >Why not, civis are like old people, once you kill a hand full or two for good >measure and say if they run you'll hunt them down, and say if they don't >coperate you'll kill, them some will try other ways but five or six troops >full loaded could wipe out the civs very easily. Well, how stupid can those idiot soldiers be? They got to sleep sometime, so only one or two will be awake. They got to eat something, or are they going to fix all of their own food? They are going to go to the whorehouse, or are they just going to rape that 15 year old? You know what you are building here? You are building a situation just like what American soldiers and Marines did in Vietnam. This is just a good way for the soldiers to commit suicide. Look at it this way, what if before your soldiers got there, there was only one bad guy? When you walk in, shooting, raping, and pillaging, you are not making friends. You are making a lot of pissed off enemies. These people might decide that that one bad guy isn't so bad now. They will put up with things, until his other bad guy buddies come rolling over that hill. Someone has to watch the prisoners(the civvies), so that is just one more person and rifle that will not be fighting that attack. Face it, the civvies need the soldiers for protection, and vice versa. If the civvies hate the soldiers, eventually, the soldiers will be forced to leave. And ass for pissing in your >own sadbox my cat does it all the time, and he gets rewarded very nicely, I >ony put him in te dry when hedoesn't piss in his own sandbox. > >as for the whole category thing I think there are six, money near military, >money not near military,barter near military, barter not near near military, >stability not near military, stability near military. Hmmm looks like six to >me. > >Until some concrete evidence comes out in print so as to a definte defintion >of all of this then its up to the fastest member on this board, so prepuse a >race, leaving from paris this saturday we all will race around the world by >car, ballon, and boat! The winner gets to be the judge for all discussion as >to what is the best. The second place person will be his slave because second >is the first place to lose. 3-5 will have to spend the weekend with my >grandmother and anyone who comes in lower than 50th will be shot. > >-Superstar Monkey > Whatever. Seems like a assinine argument you have here. Don Harden Ever Listening Ever Commenting Colonel Chaos "Hard pressed on my right. My center is yielding. Impossible to manuever. Situation excellent. I am attacking."-Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 17:02:33 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops In a message dated 98-06-25 13:34:42 EDT, you write: << Whatever. Seems like a assinine argument you have here. >> Whatever seems like old Joe Lenin and his commies buddies already brainwashed you. - -Monkey boy. P.S.Uncle Sam rules. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 20:55:13 -0500 From: Steel Glaive Subject: T:2000 alternate settings Hello everyone, now that monkey boy has everyone in a lather and there does seem to be life on the mailing list, I thought I would pose this question. Has anyone else used an "alternate" setting for T:2000? Reason I ask is 'cause in my on-again/ off-again campaign I use a setting that is different than the standard timeline. The results are pretty much the same (U.S. troops fighting for their lives in a semi-hostile Poland), it's the turn of events that cause the final war that are different. My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. Again the question, does anyone else use an alternative setting? Craig Gulledge ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 22:27:31 -0400 From: Emperor Palpatine Subject: Re: T:2000 alternate settings Steel Glaive wrote: > > Hello everyone, now that monkey boy has everyone in > a lather and there does seem to be life on the mailing > list, I thought I would pose this question. Has anyone > else used an "alternate" setting for T:2000? > Reason I ask is 'cause in my on-again/ off-again > campaign I use a setting that is different than the standard > timeline. The results are pretty much the same (U.S. troops > fighting for their lives in a semi-hostile Poland), it's the > turn of events that cause the final war that are different. > My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. > Again the question, does anyone else use an alternative > setting? > > Craig Gulledge Well, there was always the ultimate in alternate Twilight worlds, Merc: 2000. I think this one wasn't exploited as well as it could have been. I enjoyed running/writing a few Merc adventures and I really liked the alternate timeline - it was satisfying seeing the world not blown to radioactive cinders. Admittedly, most of mine ran in the "good old boy" fashion of mercenary adventure stories, inspired largely by the books "The Wild Geese" and "The Dogs of War". Rather than super commandos, my mercenaries were usually elite soldiers and powerful leaders, and our campaigns usually involved commanding a battalion or so. Neat stuff. In my regular Twilight campaign, I did something similar. My characters were in command of a small reinforced brigade of ski troops. In my game world, there was no evacuation. Rather, NATO regrouped during the spring and made an attempt to exact retribution for the disaster at Kalisz by enacting a bold winter(!) plan to end the war, which my PCs were a large part of. We never did finish the campaign (real life interdicted us), so I can't tell you if it worked out. :) - -- "I feel wonderful, drinking beer in a blissful mood, with joy in my heart and a happy liver." - -Sumerian inscription, circa 3000 b.c. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 20:30:44 -0700 From: Peter Vieth Subject: Re: T:2000 alternate settings I do. I got some ideas from Cauldron too, some from this book on Nostradamus (hehe, wonder if the PCs will ever figure it out). I also used the idea of a new nationalist president of Russia, which is the basis of one of the campaigns in Jane's AH-64D Longbow. Well, most of the PCs haven't seen any of this material so they'll never know hehe. Steel Glaive wrote: > Hello everyone, now that monkey boy has everyone in > a lather and there does seem to be life on the mailing > list, I thought I would pose this question. Has anyone > else used an "alternate" setting for T:2000? > Reason I ask is 'cause in my on-again/ off-again > campaign I use a setting that is different than the standard > timeline. The results are pretty much the same (U.S. troops > fighting for their lives in a semi-hostile Poland), it's the > turn of events that cause the final war that are different. > My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. > Again the question, does anyone else use an alternative > setting? > > Craig Gulledge - -- Peter Vieth Fitek@ix.netcom.com IGZ Handle: Fitek ICQ UIN: 3660410 Web page: http://www.netcom.com/~Fitek/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 22:58:55 PDT From: "Kenth Eriksson" Subject: Re: T:2000 alternate settings Craig wrote: >Hello everyone, now that monkey boy has everyone in >a lather and there does seem to be life on the mailing >list, I thought I would pose this question. Has anyone >else used an "alternate" setting for T:2000? >Reason I ask is 'cause in my on-again/ off-again >campaign I use a setting that is different than the standard >timeline. The results are pretty much the same (U.S. troops >fighting for their lives in a semi-hostile Poland), it's the >turn of events that cause the final war that are different. >My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. >Again the question, does anyone else use an alternative >setting? I often use an alternative setting. The scenarions tend to look almost the same after a while otherwise. I use Congo as a setting for my PBEM. And the war hasn't actually started there yet. Other times I use an "ordinary" end of the wolrd scenario for a setting. I think it's fun to play with the world and see what you can get. Kenth ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 17:20:25 -0700 From: Jeremy Menefee Subject: Re: twilight2000-digest V1998 #30 Hruggek@aol.com wrote: > Have you ever been shot with a .44? Next time you are tell me if it is still > over rated for a bullet you can buy at K Mart. Yes. The first shot BOUNCED off my windshield?!?!?, the second shot failed to penetrate my car door, several shots missed entirely, and one hit me in the shoulder, causing truly massive soft-tissue damage. Lotsoenergy, little penetration. Totally irrelevent, but an interesting side note, huh? > > > -Monkey the medicated Boy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 05:09:50 -0700 From: Jeremy Menefee Subject: Re: T:2000 alternate settings Well, I frequently have a conflict between India and Pakistan as the starting point for WWIII. China backs Pakistan (in it's never-ending quest to be a "real" superpower), and USSR backs India, as they have had much friendly relations and Russo-China frictions are well-known. The middle-east is quickly threatened, and per doctrine the US moves to protect it's industrial life-blood. Take it from there. Also, I frequently ran a campaign in USA, but as I never bought any of the stuff relating to US campaigns, I made it all up... thus the 'alternate' part. Jeremy M. Semper Fidelis Steel Glaive wrote: > Hello everyone, now that monkey boy has everyone in > a lather and there does seem to be life on the mailing > list, I thought I would pose this question. Has anyone > else used an "alternate" setting for T:2000? > Reason I ask is 'cause in my on-again/ off-again > campaign I use a setting that is different than the standard > timeline. The results are pretty much the same (U.S. troops > fighting for their lives in a semi-hostile Poland), it's the > turn of events that cause the final war that are different. > My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. > Again the question, does anyone else use an alternative > setting? > > Craig Gulledge ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 01:20:43 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: Re: Cash on start Brother Rob preached: << As to your mentioning that you get slammed five times harder than anyone else on the list, well, when you ask people what flavor crack they're smoking and then go on to attack them instead of just their position, you figure it out. >> EXACTLY! Flame that punk! Preach on Brother Rob! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 01:20:44 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops In a message dated 98-06-24 22:19:49 EDT, you write: << .......then he could blow ol' Joes head off with a Caw and gut poor martha bury them in a shallow grave then go inca on the kids by hanging them upside down from town square taking his bowie knife and puncturing the belly button and cutting down to the sternum, letting them bleed to death and stare at their own intestines...... >> YOU SO CRAZY! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 01:20:46 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: rascism In a message dated 98-06-24 22:33:09 EDT, you write: << Umm ok, how about that on time when I was called racist for my nickname? >> But didn't we decide that you were a racsist? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 01:20:50 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: Re: T:2000 alternate settings In a message dated 98-06-25 22:19:59 EDT, you write: << My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. >> Oh yeah, great idea! who? what? huh? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 00:41:44 -0700 From: Peter Vieth Subject: Re: rascism Stop with the racist crap. Or take it off the list. It's more annoying then the questions about flavored crack. KAPPAABZ@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-06-24 22:33:09 EDT, you write: > > << Umm ok, how about that on time when I was called racist for my nickname? >> > > But didn't we decide that you were a racsist? "...I hear the boot of Lucifer, I see his filthy face..." - -- Peter Vieth Fitek@ix.netcom.com IGZ Handle: Fitek ICQ UIN: 3660410 Web page: http://www.netcom.com/~Fitek/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 06:07:51 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: rascism/alt.setting.com In a message dated 98-06-27 01:34:36 EDT, you write: << But didn't we decide that you were a racsist? >> Hey frag you! Anyways, I always wanted to run a adventure in a diffrent type of enviorment like ten -twenty years before DC but still twilight. It would be fun running around on tope secert goverment mission trying to locate aliens or some crazy mutant thats eating the people who are trying to start a new town on the outskirts of some blast site where thousands of people were incenirated and whose ghosts still haunt the area thirst for the blood of some young virgin. Five headed goats named Jacko rule the wilds and its your job as good little soliders to go out and see whats going on for they military so they can use these mutations for the next post nuclear holocaust struggle. It would be cool. - -Billy Bob the milita Monkey P.S. Never trust your life in the hands of a carny. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 06:14:19 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: rascism In a message dated 98-06-27 03:54:23 EDT, you write: << "...I hear the boot of Lucifer, I see his filthy face..." >> Oh yeah! Well I see satan every night when I go to sleep! And do you think he's happy? hUh DO YOU! i GOt tHREE LEtters FOR NUTT caseS lIKe YoU... C A T CAt thats right Mr.Happy hand were gonna kill now says the goat tom the little bumble beee. But the the bumble be he doesn't care! HEs says eat your pastas billy else you gonna get booted in the head STOP PlAYING THAT MUSIC YOU HIPPY!!! Dogs speak to the aliens and if the domestication continues they will rule you one day! THE PLANET OF THE APES IS SYMBOLISM!! Cigarettes are an excellent source of vitman C! Ladys and gentlemen elvis has left the building and he wants his cough syrup, and until he gets it hitler is gonna rule you all from the grave where he plots with walt disney on better ways to sell diapers to the fish!!!! I know where you live, I know what time you eat dinner and whos 2.5 kids you are eating. AHH THE CAT!!! - -Monkey Boy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 20:23:43 -0400 From: bell029@ibm.net Subject: Racism Can we please stop this damned arguments and get back to discussing the game? Also, if anyone is looking for new materiel or ideas I suggest reading the book '48 by James Herbert or Jet Stream by Richard Muehlberg. Later. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 12:05:02 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: Re: Racism In a message dated 98-06-27 08:44:01 EDT, you write: << Can we please stop this damned arguments and get back to discussing the game? >> Agreed. ANyoNE Got AnY NEatO Guns? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 12:04:56 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: Re: rascism In a message dated 98-06-27 03:54:23 EDT, you write: << Stop with the racist crap. Or take it off the list. It's more annoying then the questions about flavored crack. "...I hear the boot of Lucifer, I see his filthy face..." >> I'd say, Stop with the satanic crap. Or take it off the list. It's more annoying then the questions about flavored crack ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 10:55:46 -0700 From: Peter Vieth Subject: Re: rascism/alt.setting.com I don't know about 20 years before, but 20 years after 2000 would be interesting. Hruggek@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-06-27 01:34:36 EDT, you write: > > << But didn't we decide that you were a racsist? >> > > Hey frag you! > > Anyways, I always wanted to run a adventure in a diffrent type of enviorment > like ten -twenty years before DC but still twilight. It would be fun running > around on tope secert goverment mission trying to locate aliens or some crazy > mutant thats eating the people who are trying to start a new town on the > outskirts of some blast site where thousands of people were incenirated and > whose ghosts still haunt the area thirst for the blood of some young virgin. > Five headed goats named Jacko rule the wilds and its your job as good little > soliders to go out and see whats going on for they military so they can use > these mutations for the next post nuclear holocaust struggle. It would be > cool. > -Billy Bob the milita Monkey > P.S. Never trust your life in the hands of a carny. - -- Peter Vieth Fitek@ix.netcom.com IGZ Handle: Fitek ICQ UIN: 3660410 Web page: http://www.netcom.com/~Fitek/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Jun 1998 22:53:52 -0500 From: Steel Glaive Subject: Re: T:2000 alternate settings KAPPAABZ@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-06-25 22:19:59 EDT, you write: > > << My idea is loosely based on Larry Bond's Cauldron. >> > > Oh yeah, great idea! > Okay, it breaks down like this. Germany and France (actually elements within each government) form an econmic partnership and begin economic expansion into the newly free Eastern Europe. The deal starts to go sour, and the two countries seek a way to deflect attention from the hard times ahead. They see military action as a solution. A fight with a frisky Poland might just solve the problem and serve to jump start the stagnating economies. Germany is to make the actual military action and France will block all U.N. efforts. At about the same time, Ultra-Nationalists (Communists)gain control of the Russian government. Germany starts its military expedition and is bogged down by a semi-modernized (equipment bought from U.S.) Poland. Russia fears German domination in Eatern Europe, so they unilaterally send troops into Poland, Slovakia and Bulgaria. Immediately, the Czech Republic, Poland, Hungary and Slovakia request assistance from the U.N. . France blocks with a security council veto. U.S. send troops anyways. The plot pretty much progresses into the standard apocalyptic nightmare after that. Oh yah, the U.S. condemns German action publicly, but comes to something of a "Gentlemans agreement" with Germany. It ignores what Germany is doing for staging rights from U.S. bases in Germany. So you wind up with U.S. troops fighting Russians, Germans fighting Russians, Pole fighting both, and the other Eastern countries split between Russia and U.S. When the U.S. decides to pull out of Europe, Operation Omega, the Gemans get nasty. So it becomes a three-way brawl. This is where the characters wind up. They are making their way to Northern Poland, to link up with XI Corps. Once they link up, they are tasked with making thier way to the Czech Republic. Once there they will act as "Indian Scouts" for the troops, most notably the 101st Air Assault Division, remaining, guiding them through Poland. Well, what do you think? Craig Gulledge ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 23:18:31 -0500 From: Rob Beck Subject: New settings At 10:55 AM 6/27/98 -0700, Peter wrote: >I don't know about 20 years before, but 20 years after 2000 would be interesting. I worked on a setting several years ago after the supplement Howling Wilderness was released. It was based in 2015 and was set at the end of the Great Drought. Civgov and Milgov were closed to patching up their differences and going after New America in earnest (taking a nod from the 2300 timeline). Most PC's would be really aged veterans of the Twilight War or up and comers raised since the time of the War. The campaign I was developing was set solely in the U.S., starting in the American Southwest and was built around kind of an Old West approach to how things were garrisoned and how towns were set up. The chief antagonists were New American enclaves and the Mexican Army. Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 04:59:22 -0700 From: Jeremy Menefee Subject: Re: New settings Rob, Any chance we could get our dirty little hands on that? Pleaseohpleaseohplease? Rob Beck wrote: > At 10:55 AM 6/27/98 -0700, Peter wrote: > >I don't know about 20 years before, but 20 years after 2000 would be > interesting. > > I worked on a setting several years ago after the supplement Howling > Wilderness was released. It was based in 2015 and was set at the end of the > Great Drought. Civgov and Milgov were closed to patching up their > differences and going after New America in earnest (taking a nod from the > 2300 timeline). > Most PC's would be really aged veterans of the Twilight War or up and > comers raised since the time of the War. The campaign I was developing was > set solely in the U.S., starting in the American Southwest and was built > around kind of an Old West approach to how things were garrisoned and how > towns were set up. The chief antagonists were New American enclaves and > the Mexican Army. > > Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 06:16:39 -0800 From: Anthony Kim Subject: Re: New settings Second that thought. Could you post it to the list or something? - -Tony Kim Jeremy Menefee wrote: > > Rob, > > Any chance we could get our dirty little hands on that? > Pleaseohpleaseohplease? > > Rob Beck wrote: > > > At 10:55 AM 6/27/98 -0700, Peter wrote: > > >I don't know about 20 years before, but 20 years after 2000 would be > > interesting. > > > > I worked on a setting several years ago after the supplement Howling > > Wilderness was released. It was based in 2015 and was set at the end of the > > Great Drought. Civgov and Milgov were closed to patching up their > > differences and going after New America in earnest (taking a nod from the > > 2300 timeline). > > Most PC's would be really aged veterans of the Twilight War or up and > > comers raised since the time of the War. The campaign I was developing was > > set solely in the U.S., starting in the American Southwest and was built > > around kind of an Old West approach to how things were garrisoned and how > > towns were set up. The chief antagonists were New American enclaves and > > the Mexican Army. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 13:20:27 -0500 From: Rob Beck Subject: Re: New settings At 04:59 AM 6/29/98 -0700, Jeremy wrote: >Rob, > >Any chance we could get our dirty little hands on that? >Pleaseohpleaseohplease? >> I worked on a setting several years ago after the supplement Howling >> Wilderness was released. It was based in 2015 and was set at the end of the >> Great Drought. Well, sure, I wouldn't mind. It would take some time to type, though, as the campaign existed as hand written notes several years ago. :) Most of it is committed to memory, so I could see what I could dig up. I'll see what I can find. Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 14:31:47 -0700 From: Jeremy Menefee Subject: Re: New settings I'm sure I speak for a lot of us when I say "Thank you"! - -JM Rob Beck wrote: > At 04:59 AM 6/29/98 -0700, Jeremy wrote: > >Rob, > > > >Any chance we could get our dirty little hands on that? > >Pleaseohpleaseohplease? > >> I worked on a setting several years ago after the supplement Howling > >> Wilderness was released. It was based in 2015 and was set at the end of the > >> Great Drought. > > Well, sure, I wouldn't mind. It would take some time to type, though, as > the campaign existed as hand written notes several years ago. :) Most of it > is committed to memory, so I could see what I could dig up. I'll see what I > can find. > > Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jun 1998 11:06:38 +1200 From: "NaT" Subject: Re: New settings Seconded, you're gorgeous NaT percival@ihug.co.nz Nathaniel Bacchus http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~percival - -----Original Message----- From: Jeremy Menefee To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM Date: Tuesday, 30 June 1998 09:31 Subject: Re: New settings >I'm sure I speak for a lot of us when I say "Thank you"! > >-JM > >Rob Beck wrote: > >> At 04:59 AM 6/29/98 -0700, Jeremy wrote: >> >Rob, >> > >> >Any chance we could get our dirty little hands on that? >> >Pleaseohpleaseohplease? >> >> I worked on a setting several years ago after the supplement Howling >> >> Wilderness was released. It was based in 2015 and was set at the end of the >> >> Great Drought. >> >> Well, sure, I wouldn't mind. It would take some time to type, though, as >> the campaign existed as hand written notes several years ago. :) Most of it >> is committed to memory, so I could see what I could dig up. I'll see what I >> can find. >> >> Rob. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 01 Jul 1998 09:32:49 PDT From: "Donald Harden" Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops >In a message dated 98-06-25 13:34:42 EDT, you write: > ><< Whatever. Seems like a assinine argument you have here. >> > >Whatever seems like old Joe Lenin and his commies buddies already brainwashed >you. > >-Monkey boy. >P.S.Uncle Sam rules. > For your information, Monkey Boy, I have faithfully served with distinction in US Army. Can you say RANGERS? Can you actually respond to the argument, instead of insulting others and looking like an idiot while doing that? Doubt it. Don Harden Ever Listening Ever Commenting Colonel Chaos "Hard pressed on my right. My center is yielding. Impossible to manuever. Situation excellent. I am attacking."-Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 15:20:07 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops In a message dated 98-07-01 12:48:58 EDT, you write: << For your information, Monkey Boy, I have faithfully served with distinction in US Army >> Dude being called private whacker is not distinction its humiliation. <> Yeah, Rangers. But I still lack too see what New Yorks hockey team has to do with this private whacker. <> Yeah I can respond all I have to do is hit the little button i've done it before, and I like looking like an idiot. Now back to your bunk Private Whacker! Monkey monkey monkey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 21:16:02 EDT From: KAPPAABZ@aol.com Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops In a message dated 98-07-01 15:35:13 EDT, you write: << << For your information, Monkey Boy, I have faithfully served with distinction in US Army >> Dude being called private whacker is not distinction its humiliation. <> Yeah, Rangers. But I still lack too see what New Yorks hockey team has to do with this private whacker. <> Yeah I can respond all I have to do is hit the little button i've done it before, and I like looking like an idiot. Now back to your bunk Private Whacker! Monkey monkey monkey >> Yeah, monkey boy. Can you say, Special Forces? any SEALs on the list...............? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Jul 1998 23:02:27 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Cash on start Oops In a message dated 98-07-01 21:27:32 EDT, you write: << Can you say, Special Forces? >> ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Jul 1998 06:23:17 -0700 From: Jeremy Menefee Subject: Recoil Is it just me or does it seem at times that the older weapons in the game, which frequently have less recoil, are often better in pure "game numbers" than more modern weapons? While I understand weight and all being taken into account as far as the recoil a given weapon produces, do the rules take other things like modern engineering into account also? I had supposed that as well as being lighter, newer weapons also had been engineered to have a comperable or even lighter recoil. Sorry if this seems to ramble - I just got off a long shift :) Whaddaya think? - -Jeremy M. Semper Fidelis ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 08:00:42 -0500 From: "Michael J. Domark, Jr." Subject: New to the list Hi, I'm new to the list. It's been a while since I've played T2K, and I was surprized that there was a mailing list for this classic game. My gaming group definatly needed a break from A D&D, and we all decided to start a T2K game. I (we) have one question/problem that I'm hoping someone will have a solution for, here goes. We have already have had one gaming session and have come across a problem. One of the player characters was standing at point blank range (aprox 10 feet) he was using an Uzi and burned a clip at his target. With the rules for Automatic fire, he totaly missed every shot. Bad die rolls. We all felt that some of the rounds should have hit his target. But our referee is a stickler for the rules, and we have tried to tell him that the rules, for any RPG, are "guidelines". It'd be nice to get another ref, but he has all the books. They are hard to find now a days. The game, although it was one session realy sucked. The 6 of us (7 if you count the ref) really want to play, but it looks like we might go back to A D&D if this keeps up. Dose anyone have a simplier way to calculate the Automatic Fire Procedure? Thanks in advance. - -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- "Der Mann Hat Einen Grossen Geist Und Ist So Klein Von Taten" ----------------------------------------------------------- The spirit of man is great, How puny are his deeds. -Anne Frank- Check 6 Member of VSQDN-541 Strike Force Mike Maj. "Milk Man" Alpha Squad, 2nd Wing, Ldr. ICQ-UIN: 7485255 ICQ Pager: http://wwp.mirabilis.com/7485255 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 11:01:18 EDT From: Grimace997@aol.com Subject: Re: New to the list Hey there. What system are you using for combat? Version 1 or later? That will explain whether the problem is easy or difficult to rectify. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 13:59:57 -0300 From: wardlow Subject: Re: New to the list What I woukd recommend is a GM with a little common sense, but barring that I always use a little rule of thumb for small caliber auto fire. up to 10 yards 90% of rounds hit ( roll over 90 to hit) decrease 10 % for each additional 10 feet and you will get a fair approximation for combat shooting for target shooting though at 25 yards if you can't put all rounds in a man sized target..... put the damn gun away and call mommy to get picked up. for target shooting use the rule of thumb that at 25 yards 90% of rounds hit. decrease accuracy 10% per 10 yards after that. The reasoning is that in target shooting you can be more careful due to not having anyone shooting at you. In both cases don't foget to figure in modifiers for cover and movement. Use these rule only in ridiculous situations such as what occurred in your game. Vlad P.S. These rules of thumb are fairly accurate. I myself have always put 100% of the rounds in a mansized target at 75 yards from a standing position but I was a qualified sniper. Michael J. Domark, Jr. wrote: > Hi, > > I'm new to the list. It's been a while since I've played T2K, and I > was surprized that there was a mailing list for this classic game. > My gaming group definatly needed a break from A D&D, and we all decided > to start a T2K game. > > I (we) have one question/problem that I'm hoping someone will have a > solution for, here goes. > > We have already have had one gaming session and have come across a > problem. One of the player characters was standing at point blank > range (aprox 10 feet) he was using an Uzi and burned a clip at his > target. With the rules for Automatic fire, he totaly missed every > shot. Bad die rolls. We all felt that some of the rounds should have > hit his target. > > But our referee is a stickler for the rules, and we have tried to tell > him that the rules, for any RPG, are "guidelines". It'd be nice to get > another ref, but he has all the books. They are hard to find now a > days. The game, although it was one session realy sucked. The 6 of us > (7 if you count the ref) really want to play, but it looks like we might > go back to A D&D if this keeps up. > > Dose anyone have a simplier way to calculate the Automatic Fire > Procedure? > > Thanks in advance. > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "Der Mann Hat Einen Grossen Geist Und Ist So Klein Von Taten" > ----------------------------------------------------------- > The spirit of man is great, How puny are his deeds. -Anne Frank- > > Check 6 Member of VSQDN-541 Strike Force > Mike Maj. "Milk Man" Alpha Squad, 2nd Wing, Ldr. > ICQ-UIN: 7485255 ICQ Pager: http://wwp.mirabilis.com/7485255 > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 14:01:36 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: New to the list In a message dated 98-07-09 09:23:49 EDT, you write: << "Der Mann Hat Einen Grossen Geist Und Ist So Klein Von Taten" >> I hear ya loud and clear on that one rubber duck. Umm here is what we do in a situation like that, its up to the gamer to take the rules into his own hands during a situation like the one you just had he can... @) Have some die rolls that you can see and noone else can that you pick up really fast (it takes alot of skill to this and get a hitting die roll without having it questioned, but those rolls always seem to hit ::wink wink nudge nudge:: or B)Get a real uzi or firearm point it at the reffree and scream "You WANNA SEE IF it works like that in real LIFE BUCKY! HUh? Do you? THATS WHAT I THOUGHT!!!!" Then shot a fellow gamer the one thats been messing with your charcter the most just a flesh wound to show you mean business. - -monkey man ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 14:08:15 EDT From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: New to the list In a message dated 98-07-09 13:17:10 EDT, you write: << I was a qualified sniper. >> Yeah me too beantown! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 14:27:10 -0500 From: "Michael J. Domark, Jr." Subject: Re: New to the list I should have in cluded this. its version 2.2 Grimace997@aol.com wrote: > > Hey there. What system are you using for combat? Version 1 or later? That > will explain whether the problem is easy or difficult to rectify. - -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- "Der Mann Hat Einen Grossen Geist Und Ist So Klein Von Taten" ----------------------------------------------------------- The spirit of man is great, How puny are his deeds. -Anne Frank- Check 6 Member of VSQDN-541 Strike Force Mike Maj. "Milk Man" Alpha Squad, 2nd Wing, Ldr. ICQ-UIN: 7485255 ICQ Pager: http://wwp.mirabilis.com/7485255 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 16:04:09 EDT From: Grimace997@aol.com Subject: Re: New to the list Well, as an attempt to help on the full auto problem, I offer this. Calculate what the to hit number would be after all the recoil effects. If the number is 0 or less, just assume that a 1 on a D20 is an effective hit, as I don't see how anyone could miss with ALL the rounds. Therefore, if a person rolls a 1 on the D20, they effectively hit with at least 1 full burst. If the person does not roll a 1, then I would arbitrarily decide, using D6, what numbers should be indicative of a hit. At point blank range, I'd say anything but a 1. Roll a number of D6 equal to the number of bursts fired. If any fall into the hit category, then roll the appropriate dice to determine how many rounds in that burst actually hit. Obviously if there is more than one target in the range bracket, any hits would have to be randomly assigned. Then, after resolving point blank, move to close, medium, long, and extreme, with each bracket having less chance on a D6 of hitting. (example 2-6 at point blank, 3 or above at close, 4 at medium, 5 and long, and 6 at extreme.) This is only an idea, as I've never had to deal with this problem. My player's usually don't burn ammo that fast! ------------------------------ End of twilight2000-digest V1998 #32 ************************************