twilight2000-digest Monday, April 14 1997 Volume 1996 : Number 041 The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 Web Site FYI RE: ADM Ping RE: Ping [none] RE: Ping Bayonet shortage? Re: Bayonet shortage? Merc 2000 Re: Ping Re: Ping Re: Ping Re: Bayonet shortage? Re: Merc 2000 Re: Merc 2000 RE: Ping Re: Merc 2000 Re: Merc 2000 Re: Merc 2000 Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Finnish submachinegun Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Finnish submachinegun Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III Re: Movies about WW III ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 4 Mar 1997 10:28:14 -0500 From: Mitchell Schwartz Subject: Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 At 03:56 PM 3/3/97 -0500, Andrwe Scott Johnson wrote: >> 1) For the people who had short articles ready for Challenge >> magazine, why not ask the maintainers of the two Twilight:2000 web sites to >> post the articles. I did. I put mine up myself - Convoy (http://world.std.com/~Ted7/convoy.html). It generates a lot of traffic (2-10 hits/day). Considering that Convoy would have earned me a whopping $25, I don't consider it that big a loss. Watch soon for additional adventures, starting with "The Bones of Napoleon" coming soon. Marco Pietersen asks:> >1. In the last digest list (nr. 39) a certain Andrew Johnson asked a >question about the Urban Guerilla Module, is this module for sale? does >anyone have it? and can I get it? Urban Guerilla is a version 1 module. Look for it in the resale or bargain pile, usually. I have it, and it is not for sale, as it is part of my full collection. >2. Does someone know any websites or places where I can find scenario's or >info about twilight? (addresses not mentioned in my last mail) watch this list. Jon Anderson but together a rather thorough list I can forward to you... >3. What the hell is this 'Morrow Project'? Is it a different game? Or is it >a t2k spinnoff? Different game. Different mechanics. Different background. Similar toys. I believe that MP is based as follows: There was a major destruction of civilization. You are part of a group that seeded high tech supplies and folks (PCs) in suspended animation who wake up about 100 years later... >5. Some FTP site for downloading T2K information (I know, there is this >MPGN.com ftp site, but it's empty) >6. Other games like Twilight: 2000? Games with a WW3 scenario (Preferably >without the nukes - they are so messy) Um, like T2K's "parallel background" Merc:2000? The problem with WW3 scenarios is that there is every reason for them to become nuclear if one side starts to win. For better results, look to wars in othert parts of the world... I'll eventually post on my website my (fairly worked out) timeline for the Angola/Zaire war... mitch Remember not only to say the right thing in the right place, but far more difficult still, to leave unsaid the wrong thing in the tempting place. -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790) Official: Unofficial: mitch@intersys.com Ted7@world.std.com http://world.std.com/~Ted7 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Mar 1997 11:41:12 +0000 From: "Judy I. Hale" Subject: Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 Mitchell Schwartz wrote: > > At 03:56 PM 3/3/97 -0500, Andrwe Scott Johnson wrote: > I did. I put mine up myself - Convoy > (http://world.std.com/~Ted7/convoy.html). It generates a lot of traffic Tried to get to your site, but got a 404 File Not Found. Are you having trouble. Ron Hale ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 4 Mar 1997 21:17:52 -0800 (PST) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 > > I did. I put mine up myself - Convoy > > (http://world.std.com/~Ted7/convoy.html). It generates a lot of traffic > Tried to get to your site, but got a 404 File Not Found. Are you having > trouble. I linked to the page through his directory: the file extension should be ".htm" rather than ".html". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 04 Mar 1997 23:25:04 +0000 From: "Judy I. Hale" Subject: Re: twilight2000-digest V1996 #40 Christopher Callahan wrote: > > > > I did. I put mine up myself - Convoy > > > (http://world.std.com/~Ted7/convoy.html). It generates a lot of traffic > > Tried to get to your site, but got a 404 File Not Found. Are you having > > trouble. > > I linked to the page through his directory: the file extension should be > ".htm" rather than ".html". That got it. Thanks. Ron Hale ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 Mar 1997 23:18:42 +0000 From: "Judy I. Hale" Subject: Web Site Hey check out this site I found. http://www.dtic.mil/defenselink/factfile/ It has access to some good pics and info. Ron Hale ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 22:41:47 -0800 (PST) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: FYI RE: ADM Greetings and Salutations: I ran across an item on the web yesterday, and I know *someone* on this list (besides me) will find it interesting.
Pictured above is the Davy Crockett, a 150 pound nuclear-tipped rocket...The W54 warhead used...weighed just 58 pounds and had an explosive yield of up to 0.25 kilotons (equivalent to 250 tons of TNT)...The W54 was the smallest and lightest thermonuclear bomb ever deployed by the United States (a variant-the B54-was used in the Special Atomic Demolition Munition [SADM], a nuclear land mine deployed in Europe, South Korea, Guam, and the United States from 1964-1989). The Davy Crockett was deployed with U.S. Army forces from 1961-1971. Between 1956 and 1963, 2,100 were produced...
One question: deployed in Guam?!?! The lengths LBJ went to in order to keep those Guamanians in line... I glanced at the Korean module Orrin mentioned a while back. Looks good. One minor correction, though: US Forces in Korea are subordinated to Pacific Command, not Central Command. Fellow mailing list member Andy Johnson and I are looking at getting together a campaign (possibly, someday, maybe), and I am curious as to what other people use as far as "house rules", if any. I am looking through the three versions of the T2k rulebook, and picking out the rules from each that I like the best (then discussing it w/ Andy). Maybe this question will actually generate some activity on this list... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Apr 1997 08:09:21 +0300 (GFT Daylight Time) From: Pietu Subject: Ping Ping! "Faith to keep looking" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 4 Apr 1997 00:00:35 -0800 From: Carlo Wejszko Subject: RE: Ping What? Carlo Wejszko (UK Technical Services) Corbis UK Limited Carlow@corbis.com (and) Carlow@uk.corbis.com >---------- >From: Pietu[SMTP:himberg.peter@hkol.fi] >Sent: Friday, April 4, 1997 6:09 AM >To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM >Subject: Ping > >Ping! >"Faith to keep looking" > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Apr 1997 13:32:47 +0300 (GFT Daylight Time) From: Pietu Subject: [none] >What? >Carlo Wejszko (UK Technical Services) >Corbis UK Limited Just testing... "Faith to keep looking" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 4 Apr 1997 15:02:02 -0800 (PST) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: RE: Ping Greetings and Salutations: I can't believe it! I never thought I'd see the day! New names on the list! Well anyway, to anyone else who's still out there: I know I said I would have Canal Zone finished by the end of March, but several unanticipated projects came up, and I haven't had a chance to finish writing it yet. I have put up some more small arms stats, as well as stats for the aircraft weapons systems I mentioned in the OOBs, but aren't in the Nautical/Aviation Handbook. Just a reminder that I moved all of my material to http://www.techrefuge.com/hector/ from GeoCities. What happened to everybody? I don't even get responses to my (occasional) posts any more. Rob M.? Loren? David? Andy? Rob B.? Orrin? The half-dozen vets we had for a while? The Dutch and Finnish guys? Anybody??? I *know* its more than just me and a couple of new people. #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!# Chris Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Apr 1997 17:43:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Bayonet shortage? Greetings and Salutations: The other day I was looking at some footage of the evacuation of US citizens from Albania, and I noticed something peculiar: the Marines who were protecting the Americans had the old Viet Nam-era M7 bayonets affixed to their M16A2s, rather than the newer M9 bayonets. Is there a bayonet shortage, or did the USMC choose not to adopt the M9 as the Army did? #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!# Chris Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Apr 1997 19:30:09 -0700 From: "awildman" Subject: Re: Bayonet shortage? - ---------- > From: Christopher Callahan > To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM > Subject: Bayonet shortage? > Date: Sunday, April 06, 1997 5:43 PM > > Greetings and Salutations: > > The other day I was looking at some footage of the evacuation of > US citizens from Albania, and I noticed something peculiar: the Marines > who were protecting the Americans had the old Viet Nam-era M7 bayonets > affixed to their M16A2s, rather than the newer M9 bayonets. Is there a > bayonet shortage, or did the USMC choose not to adopt the M9 as the Army > did? > > > #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!# > Chris Callahan > HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) > crcallahan@ucdavis.edu > callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu > hector@techrefuge.com > The Marine Corp. often has out of date equipment because they have the smallest budget of all the U.S. armed forces. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 11:43:18 +0300 (GFT Daylight Time) From: Pietu Subject: Merc 2000 Does anyone play Merc:2000? Pietu "Faith to keep looking" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Apr 1997 18:45:09 -0400 (EDT) From: OrrinLadd@aol.com Subject: Re: Ping In a message dated 97-04-04 23:02:34 EST, crcallahan@ucdavis.edu writes: << What happened to everybody? I don't even get responses to my (occasional) posts any more. Rob M.? Loren? David? Andy? Rob B.? Orrin? >> Sorry Chief, finals time coming, and I need to buckle down. Would anyone out there be willing to substitute ref a TW2k PBEM game by any chance? P.S. no new changes to heckmac's web page ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Apr 1997 17:42:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Ping Greetings and Salutations: > Sorry Chief, finals time coming, and I need to buckle down. Would anyone out That's no excuse!! My god man, where are your priorities??? Seriously, though, I've been too busy to do much with my site, either. I *fully* expect list traffic to be out of control come Summer. Where are the other people at (geographically speaking)? Orrin said he just moved to the Sac area, and I am thinking that Ron Hale (or somebody) also said he was in NorCal. Maybe we should try to get a mini-T2k convention set up (as if anyone has time for that). #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#! Chris Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Apr 1997 17:53:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Ping G&S: On Mon, 7 Apr 1997 OrrinLadd@aol.com wrote: > Sorry Chief, finals time coming, and I need to buckle down. Would anyone out > there be willing to substitute ref a TW2k PBEM game by any chance? I don't know about refereeing (I've had my fill of that for a while), but I wouldn't mind lurking/getting newsletters like Jon Anderson used to do. If you'd like help with logistical things like that (a newsletter-type deal, etc.), drop me line. #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!##!#!#!#!#!##!#! Chris Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Apr 1997 18:06:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Bayonet shortage? Greetings and Salutations: > > The Marine Corp. often has out of date equipment because they have the > smallest budget of all the U.S. armed forces. > You are of course correct, but I am just wondering how much of that is by choice versus how much is due to financial constraints. The USMC just recently got a "new" machine gun (actually a rebuild of an old one), and the impression I get from various mainstream news outlets ( we all know how accurate the press is in its coverage of military affairs ) is that the Marines have all kinds of fancy new electronic gizmos to play with (cellular phones, GPS units, etc.), and they'll be getting Ospreys (when that program finally gets rolling). The Corps is certainly not hurting for money any more than the other branches of the Armed Forces. #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!# Chris Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Apr 1997 18:17:52 -0700 From: "awildman" Subject: Re: Merc 2000 I do. I even managed to keep a Twilight 2000 campaign. - ---------- > From: Pietu > To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM > Subject: Merc 2000 > Date: Monday, April 07, 1997 1:43 AM > > > Does anyone play Merc:2000? > > Pietu > "Faith to keep looking" > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Apr 1997 07:49:13 -0400 (EDT) From: ChrisDe429@aol.com Subject: Re: Merc 2000 Hi All, I have a game of Merc:2000 running on the web. Its called Mercenary. You can check it out by going to: http://members.aol.com/lebaroud/MercWorld.htm if your browser doesn't support frames then go to: http://members.aol.com/lebaroud/MercWorld2.html I have enough characters, 30 to be exact but am Always excepting Lurkers. There are currently 3 assignments out but I haven't had the opportunity to finish the page do to a computer crash. Well, thats all. Questions or comments. Email me. Chris Deale Chrisde429@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 11:55:56 -0500 From: Robert Beck Subject: RE: Ping At 03:02 PM 4/4/97 -0800, you wrote: > What happened to everybody? I don't even get responses to my >(occasional) posts any more. Rob M.? Loren? David? Andy? Rob B.? >Orrin? The half-dozen vets we had for a while? The Dutch and Finnish guys? >Anybody??? I *know* its more than just me and a couple of new people. No Chris, it's not just you and the FNG's. Lots of projects at work have been keeping me busy. Just protecting natural resources. :) Still looking forward to seeing your Canal scenario. What's this I hear about China and the Canal? Is that just the right-wingers going hell bent for leather to convince the public that the U.S. should have the canal, or did I just dream it? I heard something to the extent that China was trying to acquire rights to it or something like that. Even if I didn't hear that right, might make a nice subplot in it's own right for Merc. Btw, I remember some talk around the list a while back about Steel Panthers 2. It can most defintely be used to recreate small scale Twilight scenarios. You can't get down to the individual soldier, but it's a squad based game, in some cases section-based. There are country inventories and generic inventories with all the equipment in it and you can even custom design your own maps. Anybody looking to run small scale battles for Twilight, this is the program for you. Hefty price tag ($50), but worth it. From what I saw, there is even some horse cavalry in the game. I played a Korean war scenario and the Chinese attacked with horse cav! Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 12:02:24 -0500 From: Robert Beck Subject: Re: Merc 2000 At 11:43 AM 4/7/97 +0300, you wrote: > >Does anyone play Merc:2000? I run an occasional Merc game, when my group feels like a more military-style game. The team I run is a former Navy SEAL, an ex-FBI agent, an ex-Ranger, and a German ex-GSG-9. They were originally more interested in destroying drug gangs and labs in the U.S. until I turned up the heat too much. It was still the U.S. after all. Now they're operating in Thailand and laying low from the sight of U.S. officials. Ok, I have to ask, what was everyone's opinion of "The Substitute" with Tom Berenger? I thought the movie was pretty good. Nice Merc on Merc action as well. I'm also in Chris Deale's Merc PBEM. It's fun, but things are a little slow now for reasons he's already explained. I'd definitely recommend taking a look for anyone who's interested. Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Apr 1997 11:28:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Merc 2000 Greetings and Salutations: > Thailand and laying low from the sight of U.S. officials. Ok, I have to > ask, what was everyone's opinion of "The Substitute" with Tom Berenger? I > thought the movie was pretty good. Nice Merc on Merc action as well. Now Rob, you're a nice guy and all, but I definitely have to say that "The Substitute" was one of the crappiest movies in memory (right behind that last Van Damme film-the one with the Russians). The cheesy plot aside, the were desperately in need of a technical advisor. The grossest error that stands out in my mind is the scene at the shooting range. When Tom "Sniper" Berenger is talking with his cohorts, one of the shooters in the background is holding a Glock. The audience hears a gunshot, and the shooter flicks his hands back, as if the pistol were recoiling. However, it is readily apparent that the Glock's trigger was never pulled (never mind seeing the slide cycle). I'm no Glock-certified armourer, but neither of my Glocks (or any of my other guns, for that matter) fires w/o pulling the trigger. Speaking of which, "Sniper" sucked, too. It started out alright, but quickly degraded into a cheesy B-movie with a cartoonish villain (the rogue sniper) and a cliche plot. #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#! Chris Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 11:39:48 +0000 From: "Judy I. Hale" Subject: Re: Merc 2000 Pietu wrote: > > Does anyone play Merc:2000? > > Pietu > "Faith to keep looking" Yep. Ron Hale ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 1997 14:57:43 +0200 From: "Marco" Subject: Movies about WW III Hello there, Well, it seems things are getting busier out here, must be the weather... Anyway, I read some opinions about movies, I never saw 'The Substitute' so I don't know if it's good or bad. I agree with Tom that Glock's don't fire by them selves (perhaps in a S. King movie, like the one with the AC/DC music - don't know the name) I did see 'Sniper', I liked that one for the action scene's, but the plot is indeed a little cliche Did anyone ever see 'Red Dawn'? It's an old '84 movie with a top cast. (Patrick Swayze, C. Thomas Howell, Lea Thompson, Charlie Sheen, Jennifer Grey). The movie has a story line simular to the Twilight story! It sure is one of my favorite movies (It isn't that good, but the story is great in my opinion) Maybe someone has seen it, it's one of the few movies I know about ww3. I am still looking for more movies in this genre. - I also like the 'Terminator' M.Pietersen@ROC-ON.nl - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- "Save energy: be apathetic" - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Apr 1997 12:38:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Greetings and Salutations: > Anyway, I read some opinions about movies, > I never saw 'The Substitute' so I don't know if it's good or bad. I > agree with Tom that Glock's don't fire by them selves (perhaps in a WHY CAN'T ANYONE GET MY NAME RIGHT?!?!? AAAARRRGGGGH!! This is a new one though. Usually people call me "Rick", or one time "Pat"; never been called Tom before, though... > S. King movie, like the one with the AC/DC music - don't know the > name) Maximum Overdrive. I haven't seen Red Dawn in many a year, so I can't really comment on it... Yesterday afternoon I glanced through an article in "Wired" magazine (okay, I was *really* bored ;) ), the gist of which is that the USMC is using a modified version of the game Doom II (called, appropriately enough, "Marine Doom") as a training aid. I have never played any of the Doom/Doom II/Quake games, but I guess the player gets different weapons like shotguns, chainsaws, etc.; in Marine Doom, each participant (I won't call them "players") is assigned an M16 or an M249. The hardware and network aspects of the system are still being implemented, but soon the setup will be: 4 marines (i.e. a fire team) , each on his own PC, interacting with: each other, the simulated enemy, and an NCO standing over them shouting "words of encouragement". #!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#!#! Chris "Tom" Callahan HTML Writers Guild/List Guide (hwg-basics) crcallahan@ucdavis.edu callahan@geology.ucdavis.edu hector@techrefuge.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 09:34:34 +0200 From: "Marco" Subject: Re: Movies about WW III - ---------- > Van: Christopher Callahan > Onderwerp: Re: Movies about WW III > Datum: woensdag 9 april 1997 21:38 > WHY CAN'T ANYONE GET MY NAME RIGHT?!?!? AAAARRRGGGGH!! Oke, I am truely sorry for my mistake... Please accept my deepest appologies. > > S. King movie, like the one with the AC/DC music - don't know the > > name) > Maximum Overdrive. Yeah, that's it... I like tha music, not the movie... > I haven't seen Red Dawn in many a year, so I can't really comment on it... I have it on tape, and I watch very very often... I really like this movie. Anyone else on this list knows it? > Yesterday afternoon I glanced through an article in "Wired" magazine > (okay, I was *really* bored ;) ), the gist of which is that the USMC is > using a modified version of the game Doom II (called, appropriately > enough, "Marine Doom") as a training aid. I also read it yesterday, I thought it was a stupid idea. What I did like, were those picturese of guns used. You see this guy running around with a heavy machinegun (thought it was an L7A2 or something) > Chris "Tom" Callahan Oke, I am sorry M.Pietersen@ROC-ON.nl - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- "Save energy: be apathetic" - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:12:59 +0300 (GFT Daylight Time) From: Pietu Subject: Re: Movies about WW III At 14:57 9.4.1997 +0200, you wrote: >Did anyone ever see 'Red Dawn'? It's an old '84 movie with a top >cast. (Patrick Swayze, C. Thomas Howell, Lea Thompson, Charlie Sheen, >Jennifer Grey). The movie has a story line simular to the Twilight >story! > Is this the movie were " Big bad guy" use Finnish submachine gun ( Jatimatic ) at last part of movie? Pietu "Faith to keep looking" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:05:44 -0400 From: Jeremy Dombroski Subject: Re: Movies about WW III > >> I haven't seen Red Dawn in many a year, so I can't really comment >on it... >I have it on tape, and I watch very very often... I really like this >movie. Anyone else on this list knows it? Yep, watch it every couple of months or so.... pretty cool, only wish they'd done more, and not been so dumb in some places.... overall good movie though. > >> Yesterday afternoon I glanced through an article in "Wired" >magazine >> (okay, I was *really* bored ;) ), the gist of which is that the >USMC is >> using a modified version of the game Doom II (called, appropriately >> enough, "Marine Doom") as a training aid. >I also read it yesterday, I thought it was a stupid idea. What I did >like, were those picturese of guns used. You see this guy running >around with a heavy machinegun (thought it was an L7A2 or something) Actually, I think it's a great idea. It's not there to teach weapons usage or anything physically tangible like that, but rather situational awareness and such. The idea is that these fire teams would be going through scenarios on maps built to reflect American embassies overseas. They'd learn where to expect ambushes, where the best places to defend from are, and so forth. Good idea, though the actual implementation was kinda lame... I downloaded it and played, and it was just kind of silly. They'd be better off using the Quake engine, and coding everything in Quake C, much easier than hacking Doom. - -Jeremy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 10:01:20 -0700 From: "Judy I. Hale" Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Saw Red Dawn many times, loved it. TTFN Ron Hale ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 13:01:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Greetings and Salutations: > like, were those picturese of guns used. You see this guy running > around with a heavy machinegun (thought it was an L7A2 or something) To be honest, I didn't notice. It is quite possible, however. If I remember correctly, the L7A2 is what the FN MAG is called in British service. The US Marines have adopted the MAG (calling it the M240G) to replace the M60. The US Army has also done this, calling the gun the M240E4/M240B (as noted on my web page ;)). The M60 has a long-standing reputation for being unreliable under adverse conditions, and my understanding is that the -60's poor performance in Op Desert Shield/ Desert Storm was the last straw for the US military, which opted for the heavier, but more reliable MAG. We might as well get all of our guns from FN. They have, after all, been making our M16A2s since the beat out Colt for the renewal of the contract. That was as of a few years ago, at least. Does anyone know if FN is still making the -16's? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 17:01:26 -0500 From: Robert Beck Subject: Re: Movies about WW III At 01:01 PM 4/10/97 -0700, Chris wrote: >FN. They have, after all, been making our M16A2s since the beat out Colt >for the renewal of the contract. That was as of a few years ago, at least. >Does anyone know if FN is still making the -16's? They sure are. And if I'm not mistaken the FN M16A2's are some of the finest of that model yet to role off the production line. I still remember Colt proclaiming noone could make the M16 better than they could. Guess they were wrong, huh? Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 22:32:31 -0500 From: Robert Beck Subject: Re: Movies about WW III At 11:12 AM 4/10/97 +0300, you wrote: >At 14:57 9.4.1997 +0200, you wrote: > >>Did anyone ever see 'Red Dawn'? It's an old '84 movie with a top >>cast. (Patrick Swayze, C. Thomas Howell, Lea Thompson, Charlie Sheen, >>Jennifer Grey). The movie has a story line simular to the Twilight >>story! >> > >Is this the movie were " Big bad guy" use Finnish submachine gun ( Jatimatic ) >at last part of movie? If that wasn't enough, weren't those Pumas that were chasing the rebels near the end of the movies? Guess they could afford the Hinds back in those days, huh? They did at least make an effort to get authentic Soviet military vehicles. Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 22:38:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Greetings and Salutations: > If that wasn't enough, weren't those Pumas that were chasing the rebels > near the end of the movies? Guess they could afford the Hinds back in those > days, huh? > They did at least make an effort to get authentic Soviet military vehicles. I can't speak to Red Dawn, but that technique (dressing up a Puma) was also used in one of the Rambo movies (it doesn't matter *which* one, they were all the same anyway;)). Of course, since the demise of the USSR, it would probably be cheaper to buy a real Hind than to buy and rebuild a Puma. So Fabrique Nationale is indeed still cranking out M16A2s. What about the M4s and M4A1s? I thought that Colt (and by subcontract, Bushmaster) were making those. So, was everyone duly impressed by the F-22 rollout yesterday? I think they spent as much on laser effects and smoke generators for the ceremony as they did on the plane itself. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 10:59:43 +0200 From: "Marco" Subject: Re: Movies about WW III I am glad people think of RedDawn as a good movie, I thought I was the only one on the surface of this earth... And I always was wondering what this gun was, this finnish submachine gun... So Mr. Pietu, what is it exactly? Oh, another question, where the heck is this town, Calju (or sumthing like it) Ik couldn't find it in our .. eh .. book-of-maps (remember I'm dutch..) And what does the term 'Eagle Driver' mean? In the Netherlands movies are subtiteld, and it said it was some sort of medal, but I think it just means an ACE Eagle pilot... (I know an eagle is an F15 b.t.w.) > > If that wasn't enough, weren't those Pumas that were chasing the rebels > > near the end of the movies? > > They did at least make an effort to get authentic Soviet military vehicles. True, for a movie from '84 they had it pretty good done, I like that If seen worse... I thing everyone saw 'Iron Eagle' (puke, puke) > So, was everyone duly impressed by the F-22 rollout yesterday? I think > they spent as much on laser effects and smoke generators for the > ceremony as they did on the plane itself. I don't understand this last part, I'm just a silly dutch guy who doesn't watch much CNN! So what's this all about? USAAF was showing the F-22? M.Pietersen@ROC-ON.nl - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- "But what ... is it good for?" -- Engineer at the Advanced Computing Systems Division of IBM, 1968, commenting on the microchip. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 13:22:51 +0300 (GFT Daylight Time) From: Pietu Subject: Finnish submachinegun >And I always was wondering what this gun was, this finnish submachine >gun... >So Mr. Pietu, what is it exactly? a Jatimatic? It`s very little and tiny recoil weapon. They ( i don=B4t really know who is made it. ) produce gun at some 90` century, but manyfactoring split for unlegally in marketing business. The Finnish police use gun in special missions. I send game statics for Tw2000 later. Pietu =20 =20 "Faith to keep looking" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 09:34:39 -0700 From: "Judy I. Hale" Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Marco wrote: > And what does the term 'Eagle Driver' mean? > In the Netherlands movies are subtiteld, and it said it was some sort > of medal, but I think it just means an ACE Eagle pilot... > (I know an eagle is an F15 b.t.w.) > All it means is that he is the pilot of a F15 eagle series aircraft. Since he was dogfighting and apparently had no co-pilot, it was probably a C model. TTFN Ron Hale ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 09:39:28 -0500 From: Robert Beck Subject: Re: Movies about WW III At 10:59 AM 4/11/97 +0200, Marco wrote: >Oh, another question, where the heck is this town, Calju (or sumthing >like it) >Ik couldn't find it in our .. eh .. book-of-maps (remember I'm >dutch..) >And what does the term 'Eagle Driver' mean? >In the Netherlands movies are subtiteld, and it said it was some sort >of medal, but I think it just means an ACE Eagle pilot... >(I know an eagle is an F15 b.t.w.) He was an F-15 pilot, near as I could figure, that's what he was referring to. >True, for a movie from '84 they had it pretty good done, I like that >If seen worse... I thing everyone saw 'Iron Eagle' (puke, puke) That and its sequels were about as bad as you could get for effects. Phantoms as MiG-29's? It only gets worse from there. Don't even talk about dialogue. Should have been clear the sequels were bad when they couldn't even get Tim Thomerson to do them. (King of the B sci-fi/action flicks) Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 10:35:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Greetings and Salutations: > > So, was everyone duly impressed by the F-22 rollout yesterday? I > think > > they spent as much on laser effects and smoke generators for the > > ceremony as they did on the plane itself. > I don't understand this last part, I'm just a silly dutch guy who > doesn't watch much CNN! Neither do I, anymore (no cable). > So what's this all about? There is currently a big debate about whether the US should spend $64 billion or some such ungodly amount on a fleet of F-22 Raptors(that's US 70 billion, as in 70 followed by 9 zeros). The Department of Defence wants to spend a few hundred billion $US on the "next generation" of combat aircraft, consisting of: the F-22, the Joint Strike Fighter, and a souped-up F-18 "Super Hornet". In order to try to convince everyone that the plane is worth the cost, a disco and laserlight show was put on during the official public unveiling of the plane. >USAAF was showing the F-22? I don't know if that's a typo or not, but if my memory isn't failing me in my old age...the USAAF was disestablished and replaced with the USAF with the enactment of the 1947 National Security Act, the same act that established the CIA. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 10:58:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Finnish submachinegun Greetings and Salutations: =20 > a Jatimatic? > It`s very little and tiny recoil weapon. They ( i don=B4t really know who= is > made it. ) As I recall , that SMG was also used in some Sylvester Stallone movie, "Cobra" , or something like that. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 10:46:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Greetings and Salutations: > Phantoms as MiG-29's? It only gets worse from there. Don't even talk about Close enough...they're both jets, with two engines...what more do you want? :) > dialogue. Should have been clear the sequels were bad when they couldn't > even get Tim Thomerson to do them. (King of the B sci-fi/action flicks) My all-time favorite is "Firebirds". Yeah. Tommy Lee Jones, Nicholas Cage, and Sean Young must all have been *very* hard up for work to do that one. Have you guys seen "Long Kiss Goodnight"? I just saw it on video (thank goodness I wasn't the one who paid for it). That movie was so stupid that it was funny. Except for Smauel L. Jackson, of course. I think he had fun with that role. Even if if had known how bad it was going to be, I still would have watched it (I'll watch anything with Samuel L. or Val; they're my favorite actors-they can take the *worst* role/dialogue and make it entertaining. Second-tier are De Niro, Kurt Russell, and Kenneth Branagh). ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 20:18:03 -0500 From: Robert Beck Subject: Re: Movies about WW III At 10:46 AM 4/11/97 -0700, Chris wrote: >My all-time favorite is "Firebirds". Yeah. Tommy Lee Jones, Nicholas Cage, >and Sean Young must all have been *very* hard up for work to do that one. That was a showcase show for the Apache, plain and simple. Tommy Lee Jones I like, but he gets the occasional stinker. This was no exception. A friend of mine and I went and saw it the first week it was out and were the only two people in the theatre. We kept quiet though. We didn't want to wake the projectionist. There's $4 I'll never have again. A Ranger friend of mine said he was amazed they were able to get that many shots of the Apache not suffering technical problems. Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 13:54:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III > That was a showcase show for the Apache, plain and simple. Tommy Lee Jones > I like, but he gets the occasional stinker. Just wait until "Volcano!" comes out... > of mine and I went and saw it the first week it was out and were the only > two people in the theatre. When I went with one of my friends, there was a grand total of about five people in the theatre (including us). I thought I read a post a while back about someone writing some T2k/M2k material for Africa. Am I remembering correctly? What is the status of that? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:11:46 -0500 From: Darrell Swoap Subject: Re: Movies about WW III At 01:54 PM 4/13/97 -0700, you wrote: >> of mine and I went and saw it the first week it was out and were the only >> two people in the theatre. > >When I went with one of my friends, there was a grand total of about five >people in the theatre (including us). > You guys were lucky. When I went to see Firebirds, I was in the Army...as an Apache Crew Chief. We went for a special viewing with two battalions of people...the entire 1st Bn, 3rd Avn Regt...and the 2nd Squadron, 1st Cavalry Regt. from the 2nd Armored Division at Ft. Hood. I thought the movie was okay I guess...especially since some of our aircraft were in it...but for the most part it was an unrealistic portrayal of the AH-64 and it's mission. Darrell Swoap ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:45:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Christopher Callahan Subject: Re: Movies about WW III Greetings and Salutations: > You guys were lucky. When I went to see Firebirds, I was in the Army...as > an Apache Crew Chief. We went for a special viewing with two battalions of Another vet. Cool. How about you briefly run down your resume for us? Inquiring minds want to know...We're always looking for any "first-hand" information sources... ------------------------------ End of twilight2000-digest V1996 #41 ************************************