twilight2000-digest Wednesday, November 6 1996 Volume 1996 : Number 030 The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: SAS Re: Change Changing places.....Changes Re: Change Changing places.....Changes Nukes for PCs Re: Nukes for PCs Re: Nukes for PCs Re: DUMB Mailing List changes Useeful US Army Doctrine Website Re: Nukes for PCs Twilight:2000 PBeM Websites! Re: Twilight:2000 PBeM Websites! Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Newbie (I'll keep it short) Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request (Evac Units) Re: Exotic Weapons Request (Air evac) Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Standardized responses? Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request Re: Exotic Weapons Request ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 25 Oct 1996 22:46:27 +0100 From: "Matthew Brunt" Subject: Re: SAS On the 22 Oct. Michael S Choi wrote :- > BTW have you ever worked with the British airborne? I've heard > their Paras are supposed to be good light infantry- if the Falklands are > an indication. After lurking for a while I'm now going to put my bit in. So here I go :- A good friend of mine used to be a para and according to him, and history proves his point, the paras are one step below the special forces status. Take the falklands for example, the training and determination of the paras gave the argies a bit of a shock when they thought it would look good to the revolting (I mean in the disposing of goverment sort, not insults/slander against the inhabitants of Argentina) civilians to try and be patriotic (idiotic more like it) by recapturing what they thought was their land. I think that a particular platoon of the paras are pathfinders - - until recently enjoying secrecy, so much so, that the army denied their existence and they purchased all of their equipment off the black market. These guys went in ahead of the main assault force to secure the LZ against external hostility, in effect, they were on their own as much as the Special Forces, without any external help and assistance. This in my opinion makes them an elite force in their own right. Thats all for me now Matthew Brunt (aka Lucky) "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people are so full of doubts." Bertrand Russell (1872-1970) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 14:28:14 -0700 From: "Mark Bull" Subject: Re: Change Changing places.....Changes I agree, I liked the percentage based system for skills in Twilight 1.0, but for the most part I like the rest of the stuff from 2.0 better. I REALLY like the way you raise your skills with the percentage based 1.0 system. It was a pretty neat idea. I don't know that they really need to add more guns, but I suppose they could take, say, several guns that would have the same stats, and like them on the same page of a weapon sourcebook. That way, not every bad guy has the same 4 or 5 weapons, but you don't have to cart around a 400 page weapon book. And I will also agree, the old modules were great. You had enough stuff in one to game for months. The newer ones I didn't like enough to bother running. And that's my 3 cents... (inflation) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Oct 1996 17:08:26 -0500 From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Change Changing places.....Changes I only played 1.0 once and I must say it really is a very good system, I enjoyed the way it is, but that my of been a once in a lifetime thing. As I said before I only played it once. Monkey Man ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 14:18:50 -0500 From: Mitch Schwartz Subject: Nukes for PCs Of course, this was one of the god things about v1's ADM (Atomic Demolition Munition IIRC) skill - almost no one would bother taking it - and without you couldn't do anything with a nuke :-) If course, I did have a few characters who invested 5% in it... just in case. Now, the fun part of course is to have the PCs stumble onto a nuke (maybe working) and let other folks find out about it.... mitch Remember not only to say the right thing in the right place, but far more difficult still, to leave unsaid the wrong thing in the tempting place. -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790) Official: Unofficial: mitch@intersys.com Ted7@world.std.com http://world.std.com/~Ted7 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:20:39 -0600 From: "David Reed" Subject: Re: Nukes for PCs - ---------- > From: Mitch Schwartz > To: twilight2000@NS.MPGN.COM > Subject: Nukes for PCs > Date: Monday, October 28, 1996 1:18 PM > Of course, this was one of the god things about v1's ADM (Atomic Demolition > Munition IIRC) skill - almost no one would bother taking it - and without > you couldn't do anything with a nuke :-) > > If course, I did have a few characters who invested 5% in it... just in case. Really? In 1st. Ed. T2k, I had all kinds of players who were "spooks" of one kind or another, and probably half of all the PCs ever created had that skill... [Perhaps this is NOT a comment on the players, but their perception of the GM and his "James Bond" fetish. -ed.] > Now, the fun part of course is to have the PCs stumble onto a nuke (maybe > working) and let other folks find out about it.... Everybody was convinced at some point that they would come across one, and they always made sure that at least one member of the party was skilled enough to disarm it, or launch it... ;-) I don't know what good 5% would do you... It was always 45% or better, or don't even bother. ______________________________________________________________________ David Reed $$ | webmaster@techrefuge.com $$ What do you mean by "it's all politics"? | $$ Are you trying to suggest that there has | All material and ideas $$ EVER been anything else? | are (c) David Reed, 1996 $$ | ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 28 Oct 1996 16:26:42 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Nukes for PCs On Mon, 28 Oct 1996, David Reed wrote: > Really? In 1st. Ed. T2k, I had all kinds of players who were "spooks" of one > kind or another, and probably half of all the PCs ever created had that > skill... [Perhaps this is NOT a comment on the players, but their perception > of the GM and his "James Bond" fetish. -ed.] Supposedly red legs in Germany and Korea got a big lecture with a capital L about tac nuke rounds for 155 howizers and eight inch guns. Mainly though there's speical platoons and companies at corps level that gets to hand out the sub-kiloton weaponry and tell the gun bunnies "To knock themselves out" and "Don't worry gamma rays won't kill you;)" In Twilight though I don't know if the skill's worth everything. everybody supposedly used all the nukes and there any more, right;)? > Everybody was convinced at some point that they would come across one, and > they always made sure that at least one member of the party was skilled > enough to disarm it, or launch it... ;-) Gee does that mean if the players should suddenly run into a nuke tipped ATACMS?;) (purposed replacement of the ever loved Lance ballistic missile system). Gah the idea of chracters actually seeing nukes in Twilight strikes me as serious Velveeta. Some wisdom- people who do use chem weapons or nukes tend to get hit, and with considerable interest. Unlike conventional weapons tac nukes and nerve gas don't grow out of the ground.. MAD aside;). Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 18:33:44 +0200 (EET) From: Matti Aistrich Subject: Re: DUMB On Fri, 25 Oct 1996 Hruggek@aol.com wrote: > common sense not to call a person I dont knbow dumb or out of it. You little > biget how do you think you can drw a conclusion about a person who has won > many many national and state awards for his role playing and GMing. > So you game for awards... hmmm... - --------------------------------------------- : Perfect is : Matti M. Aistrich : : only just : : : good enough! : aistrich@kyyppari.hkkk.fi : - --------------------------------------------- - -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 GB d+(++) s-:+ a- C+ W+ w PS+ PE++ Y+ t--- X- R++ tv+ b+ D++ G e++>+++ h-- y+++ - ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 13:44:25 -0500 From: Rob Miracle Subject: Mailing List changes I upgraded to Majordomo 1.94 today. Things seem to be ok, but there may be a digest hiccup from today. You can retrieve the digests via email, ftp, or WWW. http://www.mpgn.com/Gaming/ ftp://ftp.mpgn.com/Gaming/ or send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com and get help on retrieveing files via e-mail. If you have problems let me know. Rob - -- Rob Miracle Tantalus Inc. Be patient or be a patient. -- Anton Devious ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Oct 1996 19:53:52 -0700 (MST) From: scharlto@rtd.com (Steve Charlton) Subject: Useeful US Army Doctrine Website I was rooting around the web today and found a really cool source of info for US Army doctrine; specifically armor and mech infantry doctrine. http://www.entelechy-inc.com/docs/knoxdoc/ The amusing this about this (which I did not realize until I went back to the site this morning) is that the "webmaster" for the site is some guy named Dave Nilsen. Where have I heard that name before? Steven T. Charlton I don't recall installing this "General Protection Fault" Screen Saver scharlto@avalon.com (work) scharlto@rtd.com (home) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 01:10:32 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Re: Nukes for PCs > In Twilight though I don't know if the skill's worth >everything. everybody supposedly used all the nukes and there any more, right;)? wrong. If ALL the nukes were used, there would be no PCs to play. There would be no game to play, it'd be called 3rd glass rock from the sun. > Gah the idea of chracters actually seeing nukes in >Twilight strikes me as serious Velveeta. Well, twilight IS kinda like velveeta......one or two characters can take on a whole platoon or more and win! OR put on you kelvar Vest aanf jump on that grenade......and live! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Nov 96 14:44:21 PST From: jono@baltica.UCSD.EDU (Jon Anderson) Subject: Twilight:2000 PBeM Websites! Hi All, Announcing the Twilight:2000 PBeM Websites! Check it out today! http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Arcade/2521 http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/3857 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Nov 1996 23:31:25 -0500 From: OrrinLadd@aol.com Subject: Re: Twilight:2000 PBeM Websites! here's another shameless plug for my and heckmac@gnn.com's webpages http://members.gnn.com/heckmac/tw2k.htm http://home.aol.com/orrinladd ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 09:10:21 -0500 From: John Banagan Subject: Exotic Weapons Request Hi, I was wondering if anyone had any information (stats) on exotic weapons. Ny exotic weapons, I mean flamethrowers and other non-conventional weapons players might have used in your campaign. Thanks, John B. John Banagan, Medical Specialist (91B) HHC 10th Mountain Division (Light Infantry) "Climb to Glory!" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 13:39:26 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request On Mon, 4 Nov 1996, John Banagan wrote: > I was wondering if anyone had any information (stats) on exotic weapons. Ny > exotic weapons, I mean flamethrowers and other non-conventional weapons > players might have used in your campaign. > Try Jane's Infantry Weapons of the World. Modern armies don't like flamethrowers. Think about it a fuel tank filled with napalm and a some sort of compressed air tank- add an ignition device. Even if there's a nozzle adjuster (like a garden hose sprayer) a manpack flamethrower's only going to have a maximum effective range of 50 meters or so. Still flamethrowers are great- not so much they zorch people into burnt long pig but when used against enclosed structures (ie bunkers and houses and basements) the firestorm effect; the oxygen bruns away before the people plus overpressure. Nowadays modern armies (or at least engineers) pack rocket launchers like the M202A1/A2 FLASH or RPO-A. The rockets warheads work either on the fuel air principle or spread thermite or phosphorous compounds over its burst radius. Neat stuff. Granted though regular grunts seldom see this type of hardware and are just as content in knocking out a machinegun or mortar position with a LAW or a Dragon. Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 16:49:08 -0500 From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request on Flame Throwers just look in the Heavy Weapons book. I was wondering if any one out there had any stats on glocks and the .50 caliber Desert Eagle. A few guns I would like to see. And FN Herstal's PN90 in 5.7mm, the USAS-12 auto shotgun, the Hammerli 280. Just a few nice guns. Monkey Man ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 96 14:17:34 PST From: jono@baltica.UCSD.EDU (Jon Anderson) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request >>"The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 << "CONAN...WHAT IS BEST IN LIFE!?" can you dig it! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 96 14:19:52 PST From: jono@baltica.UCSD.EDU (Jon Anderson) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request >>I was wondering if any one out there had any stats on glocks and the .50 << We are treating a 9mm Glock 19 the same as a Berretta 92. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 17:33:28 -0500 From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request I have one More, The Steyr ACR. Shots flechette rounds in a nice three round burst or, you can go Semi-Auto. Monkey Man. P.S. Looks like a futureristic kind of gun if youve seen em at shows, Comes with a nice1.5x spot scope,and I heard it shots in a start line to about 2,000 feet. And the bullet travels faster than at 5,000 feet per second. A really really nice gun. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 17:38:36 -0500 From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request In a message dated 96-11-04 17:36:57 EST, you write: << start >> should be straight sorry! And For the Post about the glocks, Thanks but if you where confused about the .50 caliber i didnt mean the glock in .50 caliber in meant the Desert Eagle. Thanks, Monkey Man ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 15:38:43 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request On Mon, 4 Nov 1996 Hruggek@aol.com wrote: > on Flame Throwers just look in the Heavy Weapons book. > I was wondering if any one out there had any stats on glocks and the .50 > caliber Desert Eagle. A few guns I would like to see. And FN Herstal's PN90 > in 5.7mm, the USAS-12 auto shotgun, the Hammerli 280. Just a few nice guns. The PN90 has been a hard sell. One reason- how many 5.56mm rifles are out there? What's the new NATO standard magazine for rifles? Face it- no matter what FN claims for the performance of the 5.7mm round that company's goping to have an easier time selling FNCs. Best examples- the Swedish army, Indonesia's military, and the Belgian army. Even the Germans (namely HK, Dynamit Nobel, and the German Ministry of Defense) opted for the new G36- which reminds me a lot of the Italian Beretta AR70/90. The USAS12 came at a bad time. It's based on the old Achisson selective fire shotguns but made by Daewoo. Unfortunately the assault rifle ban and the fact the US army found out the CAW and ACR programs were beginning to look the 1960s SPIW concept. Nobody wants to buy super weapons for grunts- not when some countries are still tooling up for 5.56mm rifles and machineguns. Besides the USAS12 weighs 16 pounds fully loaded with a twenty round drum- it takes a beefy dude to keep that weight stuck to his shoulders- even if felt recoil's "minimal". Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 15:46:22 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request On Mon, 4 Nov 1996 Hruggek@aol.com wrote: > I have one More, The Steyr ACR. Shots flechette rounds in a nice three round > burst or, you can go Semi-Auto. > Gee- it'd be nice if Steyr-Mannlicher GmBH could with bolt handle and ejection port so if the rifle jams a grunt can clear the thing rather than trying to field strip the puppy. > > P.S. Looks like a futureristic kind of gun if youve seen em at shows, Comes > with a nice1.5x spot scope,and I heard it shots in a start line to about > 2,000 feet. And the bullet travels faster than at 5,000 feet per second. A > really really nice gun. SPIW program. They found out a single long needle moving at 1500 meters per second doesn't do squat against the human body. Excessive penetration and nothing in the way of a good X-section. In short a very long and very small wound channel; high tech acupuncture. The idea is to turn the opponent's guts into exploding red jello. Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 19:38:38 +0000 From: Mark Withers Subject: Newbie (I'll keep it short) Well, I'm new to the list, and I'm glad to see a couple of familiar faces (Choi... I shoulda' guessed he'd be on the list for a "Real Man's" game.). Okay, long to short, I'm new, so please bear with me. Thanks. - -- Mark Withers alias: Geoffrey Ochten alias: Maj. Masaki Rei ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 21:20:54 -0600 From: "David Reed" Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request - ---------- > From: Jon Anderson > To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM > Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request > Date: Monday, November 04, 1996 4:19 PM > > >>I was wondering if any one out there had any stats on glocks and the .50 > << > > We are treating a 9mm Glock 19 the same as a Berretta 92. > HERESY!!! How could you blaspheme so? Ack! *gasp* ____________________________________________________________________________ GENERALIST [jen-a-ruh-list] noun skilled in website architecture, graphic designs, comparative linguistics, public policy analysis, C/C++ programming, dark future and science fiction writing, martial arts, and euchre. See also DAVID REED , CONSULTANT, WEBMASTER, PERPETUAL STUDENT, WEBHEAD, ROLEPLAYING GAMES, WEAPON ENTHUSIAST, NRA MEMBER, GEEK, UNEMPLOYED. All contents Copyright (C) David Reed, 1996. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 21:30:05 -0600 From: "David Reed" Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request - ---------- > From: Hruggek@aol.com > To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM > Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request > Date: Monday, November 04, 1996 4:33 PM > > I have one More, The Steyr ACR. Shots flechette rounds in a nice three round > burst or, you can go Semi-Auto. > P.S. Looks like a futureristic kind of gun if youve seen em at shows, Comes > with a nice1.5x spot scope,and I heard it shots in a start line to about > 2,000 feet. And the bullet travels faster than at 5,000 feet per second. A > really really nice gun. You are confusing the AUG with the ACR... The AUG does NOT fire flechette rounds. It comes in .22LR, .223, and I think, 9mm. If you can get one that would survive firing a round at 5k ft. per second, it would be cheap at any price... So buy it... Heh. Been watching _Eraser_ again? ____________________________________________________________________________ GENERALIST [jen-a-ruh-list] noun skilled in website architecture, graphic designs, comparative linguistics, public policy analysis, C/C++ programming, dark future and science fiction writing, martial arts, and euchre. See also DAVID REED , CONSULTANT, WEBMASTER, PERPETUAL STUDENT, WEBHEAD, ROLEPLAYING GAMES, WEAPON ENTHUSIAST, NRA MEMBER, GEEK, UNEMPLOYED. All contents Copyright (C) David Reed, 1996. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 19:37:32 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request To all: When you get down to it- in terms of game play. A nine mil handgun is a nine mil handgun. And an assault rifle is an assault rifle. In terms of role playing it's really hard to make a for/against a steyr AUG, a Glock nine, an AK, a M16, etc especially when nearly all these weapons tend to use the same ammo. I'm a gun nut so I like to hammer on things like handling/ergonomics, individual accuracy and cyclic rate of fire, optics, etc. When you get right down to it- does it really effect role playing? Still just for the pretty pics and in terms of technical accuracy modern RPGs like Twilight tends to go overboard in things that go bang-bang. Granted anything a grunt carries doesn't really cheese out a RPG- namely due to Newtonian physics (or the adherence of game designers to Newtonian laws). Giving a small group of Twilight players a full battery of MLRS tracks and a company of Oshkosh HEMTTs with rocket pallets is pure and unadulterated Velveeta. Having Team Yankee for a Twilight group with M1s, Brads, FIST-Vs, and 120mm mortar tracks plus grunts carrying everything from IIR anti-tank missiles to .45s- that's cheddar. So without a doubt Twilight pretty much holds a place in my book in terms of a real MAN'S GAME (insert maniacal Tim Allen grunts;) Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 09:31:17 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request writes: > >Hi, > >I was wondering if anyone had any information (stats) on exotic >weapons. Ny >exotic weapons, I mean flamethrowers and other non-conventional >weapons >players might have used in your campaign. Well, try looking in the heavy weapons guide. It's got some Flamethrowers. Challenge magazine also has had some new and improved products from time to time. One weapon which my players love is the Colt M-100 Special Objectives Firearm. It is essentially a Colt M1911A1 pistol redesigned and outfitted with a stock, scilencer, laser sight, thermal imager...which can fire 3 round bursts, and uses special ammunition, giving it up to a damage of 5. It's cost is $10,000(R\-) I believe.......................... It appeared in a challenge magazine (I forget which) authored by a former Vietnam Vet, and retired officer from the 82nd, who wrote a few old modules for twilight. Some players (In MERC2000) have even wanted paintball guns, but using nerve agent paintballs......................it sucks when the balls break in the barrel. My question for you is this: What exactly comes with the HMMV Ambulance? How many people can it hold, and what kind of medical supplies? Refridgeration? etc., etc., Christopher Stainton former Military Police (95B) 82nd Airborne Division, HHC It's kinda nice seeing some traffic on this list again....................................... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 10:50:45 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request On Tue, 5 Nov 1996, Christopher R Stainton wrote: > One weapon which my players love is the Colt M-100 Special Objectives > Firearm. When it comes to "bang bang" genius few people can watch John Moses Browning. > It is essentially a Colt M1911A1 pistol redesigned and outfitted with a > stock, scilencer, laser sight, thermal imager...which can fire 3 round > bursts, and uses special ammunition, giving it up to a damage of 5. > It's cost is $10,000(R\-) I believe.......................... Feh- the three round burst reminds me a lot of the WW2 project that turned the .45 into a machine pistol. Too much recoil. If you want a .45 SMG that bad scream at HK to get off their asses and come up with a beefed up MP5 that's chambered for .45 ACP. > My question for you is this: > What exactly comes with the HMMV Ambulance? > How many people can it hold, and what kind of medical supplies? > Refridgeration? > etc., etc., Don't quote me on this but there's actually two kinds of Hummer ambulances- the Mini and Maxi. Both of them can hold a two or three man medic crew plus room for at least two or three more. A "crash cart", monitors, and even a small refegirator to store blood plasma (whole blood's usually kept at a real hospital) along with necessary first aid items. A civilian ambulance dressed in cammie is my logical guess. All conjecture but a lot of trauma these ambulance crews do see are very similar to ones civilian paramedics work on. Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 16:55:09 -0500 From: Hruggek@aol.com Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request In a message dated 96-11-04 22:27:09 EST, you write: << You are confusing the AUG with the ACR... The AUG does NOT fire flechette rounds. It comes in .22LR, .223, and I think, 9mm >> I was talking about the ACR! Not the AUG. Monkey Man ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 19:28:02 -0500 From: John Banagan Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request (Evac Units) >My question for you is this: >What exactly comes with the HMMV Ambulance? >How many people can it hold, and what kind of medical supplies? >Refridgeration? >etc., etc., > >Christopher Stainton >former Military Police (95B) >82nd Airborne Division, HHC Currently the US Army uses three types of HMMVs for ambulance use. One is a 'soft top' and the others are hard tops. The FLA (front line ambulances) are hard tops and either carry 2 passengers while the other carries 4 passengers. Allow me to go into depth in this subject as I just happen to have my evac manule with me... GROUND AMBULANCES - ----------------- a. Truck, Ambulances, 4x4, Armored, M996 and M997 The M996 and M997 armored ambulances are tactical vehicles designed for use over all types of roads, as well as cross country terrain. It can also operate in all weather conditions. These ambualnces are diesel-powered and euipped with four-wheel hydraulic service brakes. The ambualnces can be heated and ventilated. Only the M997 can be airconditioned. Supplemental electrical power to operate the life support equipment is available. For operations in an NBC environment, the M996 and M997 ambulances are equipped with a Gas-Particulate Filter Unit (GPFU). Patient Carrying Capacities: (1 driver/medic and 1 TC/medic. There is a stool unit in the back for an additional medic. It's used so that the TC can monitor the patients in the rear.) Truck, Ambulance, 4x4, 2 Litter, Armored (M996) - ----------------------------------------------- 2 Litter Patients, or 6 Ambulatory Patients, or 1 Litter and 3 Ambulatory Patients Truck, Ambulance, 4x4, 4 Litter, Armored (M997) - ----------------------------------------------- 4 Litter Patients, or 8 Ambulatory Patients, or 2 Litter and 4 Ambulatory Patients Editors Note: What we have in our M997 is basic life support equippment (air tanks, defibrillators, splints, traction devices, etc...) nothing fancy. The air conditioning is only in the back of the units, not the driver/TC section although both sections have separate heater units. Comes in handy here in the land of the 'frozen chosen.' The unarmored version of the M996 comes with a plastic soft top and I think only holds one patient in the rear. Basically it's a quick field conversion from a regular HMMV to an ambulance. The following vehicles I don't really use much so I'll give you the gist. b. Truck, Ambulance, 1 1/4 ton, 4x4, M1010 Diesel powered. Has NBC protection. Has separate power units for life-support equipment. Has additional storage space. Has a boom to help load patients into holding section. Patients: 4 Litters or 8 Ambulatory or a combination of each. c. Truck, Ambulance, 1 1/4 ton, 6x6, M792 Being phases out. Patients: 2 Litter and medic, or 3 Ambulatory and medic or 6 Ambulatory d. Truck, Ambulance, 1/4 ton, 4x4, M718, Frontline Being phased out. Patients: 3 Litter (TC/medic must be left at pickup site due to limited space) or 2 Litter and 1 ambulatory and medic, or 3 ambulatory patients e. Buses (Ambulances) Using buses for patients is usually limited to areas where not much combat is expected. Conversion kits are available. The amount of patients the bus can hold depends on the bus size. Patients: f. Carrier, Personnel, Full-Tracked, Armored, M113, T113E2 The M113 armored personnel carrier is a standard evacuation vehicle. It is lightly armored to afford patient protection against small arms. Wearing the helmet inside the vehicle provides added protection, especially over rough terrain, due to the low silhouette. Movement of the tracks propels and steers the vehicle. It is highly manueverable and capable of: 1) Amphibious operations on inland lakes and streams. 2) Extended cross-country travel over rough terrain. 3) High-speed operations on improved roads and highways. Patients: 10 Ambulatory or 4 Litter The following are non-standard units for evac'ing patients. Unit - ---- Bradley infantry fighting vehicle M2/3 Light weapons carrier, M274 (1 litter and 1 ambulatory, or up to 3 litter, or 2 ambulatory) Truck, cargo, 1 1/4 ton, M880/890, and M1008 (up to 5 litters or 8 ambulatory) Truck, cargo/troop carrier, 1 1/4 ton, 4x4, M998 (up to 5 litters or 8 ambulatory) Truck, cargo, 2 1/2 ton, 6x6, wide bed, M35 'deuce and a half' (up to 12 liiters and possible 24 ambulatory) Truck, cargo, heavy expanded, mobility tactical truck (HEMTT), 8x8, cargo, M977 (9 litters) Semi-trailer, cargo, 22 1/2 ton, M871 (16 litters) Truck, cargo, 5 ton, 6x6, wide bed (up to 12 litters and possibly 24 ambulatory) Truck, utility, M151 (2 litter) Trailer, 1/4 ton, two-wheel (2 litter) usually used in conjunction with M151 Armored personnel carrier, M113 (non-standard ambulance) Tractor, 5 ton, with stakes and platform trailer High-mobility, multi-purpose wheeled vehicle, M998 The next installation will be on medevac... John Banagan, Medical Specialist (91B) HHC 10th Mountain Division (Light Infantry) "Climb to Glory!" jbanagan@imcbbs.imcnet.net (preferred) jbanagan@juno.com (alternate) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 19:38:12 -0500 From: John Banagan Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request (Air evac) Common rotary wing aircraft are as follows and as a side note, OH is observation helicopter, UH is utility helicopter, CH is cargo/transport, and of course, AH is attack. a. UH-60A Blackhawk Patients: Has a maximum configuration of six litter patients and one ambulatory or seven ambulatory patients. b. UH-1H/V Iroquois Patients: Has a maximum configuration of six litter patients or nine ambulatory patients. Editors note: I haven't had the chance to ride in the Blackhawk. I have used the Iroquois. I was a litter patient on an field traing excercises and I remember one of the scarriest moments was when we did a deep bank and I could actually see the ground from my laying position on the litter. I felt like I was gonna slide out of the muther... Thank God for tight straps! c. CH-47 Chinook Patients: Has a maximum of 24 litter or 31 ambulatory. I unfortunately don't have the stats for fixed wing aircraft evacuation. Perhaps someone could enlighten us. John Banagan, Medical Specialist (91B) HHC 10th Mountain Division (Light Infantry) "Climb to Glory!" jbanagan@imcbbs.imcnet.net (preferred) jbanagan@juno.com (alternate) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 22:06:46 -0600 From: "David Reed" Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request - ---------- > From: Michael S Choi > To: twilight2000@MPGN.COM > Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request > Date: Tuesday, November 05, 1996 12:50 PM > > It is essentially a Colt M1911A1 pistol redesigned and outfitted with a > > stock, scilencer, laser sight, thermal imager...which can fire 3 round > > bursts, and uses special ammunition, giving it up to a damage of 5. > > It's cost is $10,000(R\-) I believe.......................... > > Feh- the three round burst reminds me a lot of the WW2 project > that turned the .45 into a machine pistol. Too much recoil. If you want a > .45 SMG that bad scream at HK to get off their asses and come up with a > beefed up MP5 that's chambered for .45 ACP. Why do this when you can get the "FBI Special"? An MP-5 chambered for 10mm! Higher muzzle velocity, better expansion... (Higher maintenance and recoil, too...) But, hey... ____________________________________________________________________________ GENERALIST [jen-a-ruh-list] noun skilled in website architecture, graphic designs, comparative linguistics, public policy analysis, C/C++ programming, dark future and science fiction writing, martial arts, and euchre. See also DAVID REED , CONSULTANT, WEBMASTER, PERPETUAL STUDENT, WEBHEAD, ROLEPLAYING GAMES, WEAPON ENTHUSIAST, NRA MEMBER, GEEK, UNEMPLOYED. All contents Copyright (C) David Reed, 1996. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 21:31:25 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request Jon Anderson writes: >>>I was wondering if any one out there had any stats on glocks and the >.50 ><< > >We are treating a 9mm Glock 19 the same as a Berretta 92. > A Glock 19 though is lighter than the Beretta. And what's the Magazine Capacity? 19 rounds? The Glock 17's is 17 rounds, i think. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 21:31:25 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Standardized responses? >>Giving a small group of Twilight players a full battery of MLRS tracks and a company of Oshkosh HEMTTs with rocket pallets is pure and unadulterated Velveeta. (SNIP)<< Haven't I seen this before? I think the exact same lines, too. Do you have this saved somewhere for use at later date(s) :-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 21:31:25 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request Monkey Man writes: >on Flame Throwers just look in the Heavy Weapons book. >I was wondering if any one out there had any stats on glocks and the >.50 >caliber Desert Eagle. A few guns I would like to see. And FN Herstal's >PN90 >in 5.7mm, the USAS-12 auto shotgun, the Hammerli 280. Just a few nice >guns. Some of those are taken from Dark Conspiracy........ It's got the stats ready to go. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 21:36:13 -0800 (PST) From: Michael S Choi Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request On Tue, 5 Nov 1996, David Reed wrote: > > Feh- the three round burst reminds me a lot of the WW2 project > > that turned the .45 into a machine pistol. Too much recoil. If you want a > > .45 SMG that bad scream at HK to get off their asses and come up with a > > beefed up MP5 that's chambered for .45 ACP. Read the Guardians series of books by Richard Austin. Incidentally .45 rounds are subsonic. Nifty, eh. > Why do this when you can get the "FBI Special"? An MP-5 chambered for 10mm! > Higher muzzle velocity, better expansion... (Higher maintenance and > recoil, too...) But, hey... 10mm is a dead round. Back during the early to mid 80s everybody thought it would replace nine mil only to find out the cartridge was too damn big to shove lotsa rounds into a magazine like a Wonder Nine. .40 S&W seems to be more successful because the it's has 10mmx20mm or 21mm dimensions- the .40 is more based on nine mill dimensions but it's popularity is only in the US (doesn't hurt that some cop departments decided to go for guns in .40 Smith). As one person put it the .40 is a yuppie round. Yes- the HK MP5 is also chambered in .40. Mad Mike "The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters." Genghis Khan 1226 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 21:31:25 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request Personally, I'd like to see the Manlicker Carcano Sniper rifle stats...... and the "Magic Bullet" rules. How to get that one bullet to bounce all over the place,, through two people, and remain in "pristine" condition. I think twilight really did an injustice NOT printing that data to us consumers :-) STATS Manlicker Carcano RANGE: Not that bad DAMAGE: Insane AMMO: Magic Bullets ROF: Like too fast to believe MAGIC BULLET STATS Damage: 4D6 per "bounce" Roll 1D20 to determine the number of "bounces" the Bullet will get once it has penetrated the target's armor. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 03:27:53 -0500 From: OrrinLadd@aol.com Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request all you gun nuts check out this web page http://members.gnn.com/heckmac/tw2k.htm Its got TW2k stats for many firearms. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 04:10:56 EST From: kappaabz@juno.com (Christopher R Stainton) Subject: Re: Exotic Weapons Request >> If you want a .45 SMG that bad scream at HK to get off their asses and come up with a beefed up MP5 that's chambered for .45 ACP.<< Why? Why not take the M3, or Thompson SMGs? This whole fascinating with HK MP series is a bit overrated for me. But hey, In game stats the rule. In the real world.......................Hmmmmm ------------------------------ End of twilight2000-digest V1996 #30 ************************************